On Giving Value

I feel like "value" is one of those concepts that is thrown about in a pretty nebulous fashion. You hear guys say "give value" all the time, but I get the impression that a fair number of them don't know what this actually means. Similarly to "be outcome independent" or "be in the moment," it has become a mantra with little real substance behind it. Furthermore, I think that a lot of guys in the community are value junkies, and are obsessed with measuring exactly how much value everyone consumes and emits. I feel like a lot of the advice to newbies on "how to give value" is misdirected.

Before I start, I'm going to admit that there are MANY kinds of value. However, I am concerned primarily with value from the PUA perspective. And from the PUA perspective, I am talking about how do you give value to other guys in the community.

What is not "Giving Value?"
For some reason, one of the things that irks me the most are the non-offers of value that come up from time to time. The sad thing is that these are well intended. Guy joins the community, sees "give value" plastered all over the place, and decides that he has to do something. He has worked as a professional dog washer in the past, so he volunteers to wash anyone's dog for free. Maybe he gets a few compliments for this, but it is likely that no one takes him up, and in the end, it doesn't do much for his standing in the community.

Why is this? First of all, this is a pretty big offer to just put out there. It's kind of like offering to buy a random girl a drink. It's kind of out of the blue, and some people would feel like you want something in return. There's a second reason, though, and I think that is more important. This "value" is totally irrelevant to pickup. I don't know about you, but I got into this to improve my skills with women. Maybe my dog needs to get washed, but so far as I know, that isn't going to get me laid. Which brings me to my next point...

What is "Giving Value?"
Giving value from the PUA perspective is enhancing the probability that other guys will get laid. It's pretty simple; if you increase then chance that I will get laid, then as a PUA you are giving me value. A lot of newbies wonder how they can get a chance to hang out with more experienced guys. Unsurprisingly, a large percentage of the guys out there will hang out with anyone who offers enough value.

How Do I Give Value?
So I'm going to preface this by saying that there are many ways to give value. I have seen some extremely creative value displays during my time in the community, and I don't want to get into a laundry list. However, here are a few that are both the simplest and most effective.

1) Be Positive - It's amazing; this is so simple, yet many guys fail to do it. You see them in a bar, and they look like they could be dying. Be genuinely positive and upbeat when you are out in field. Always say nice things to everyone, and never give criticism unless explicitly requested (and, even then, be careful about what you say). Above all, have fun. Positive people are great to be around. Even if a guy has no skills, if he is positive and upbeat, he is an asset to be out with.

2) Open Sets - When I'm out in the field with a wing, the most important thing I can see him do is to open a lot of sets. First of all, this motivates me to go out and open sets myself. Second of all, if my wing is approaching a lot, it is guaranteed that aren't going to spend the night in a chode crystal by the bar. Again, I don't care if a guy has any skill; so long as he is opening a lot, he is doing his job from my perspective. If he isn't pushing himself, that's another question, but if he is being positive AND opening, he is likely going to be pushing himself.

3) Be Consistent - I found that it took about 4-6 months for me to start going out with guys who I saw as "senior." One reason is that a lot of guys get into the community and then drop out within that period of time. It isn't worth a more experienced guy investing in you as a wing (I find that it takes a couple of weeks to a month to build wing vibe) unless you have proven that you stick with it. If you go out consistently every week (and hopefully 2-3+ times per week) for many months, people will notice, and they will want to hang out with you. Boston is a fairly small town - even if you don't plan to hang out with people, you will run into them in the field IF you are out enough.

4) Be Reliable - Don't flake on your wings. If a guy no shows more than once in a while (or chronically shows up at 11:30 PM), I'm probably not going to want to hang out with him all that much. This is an easy one that most people fail to do. Take this stuff as seriously as anything else in your life that you commit to.

In-Set Wing Skills
Notice that I haven't mentioned in-set wing skills yet. Are they unnecessary? To the contrary, they are pretty important. The problem I've found is that most guys can open, hook, and hold a set before they start to do a significant amount of in-set winging. It isn't until you start to need a wing in your sets that you start to learn how to be a good wing in others' sets. A lot of guys who have been around for less than six months aren't going to know much about being a good wing in-set (other than what they read on mASF about Mystery and Style). Most of their winging is going to involve pushing their friends into sets, and waiting around to encourage them when they blow out. You may occasionally be pulled into someone else's set, but you probably aren't going to be expected to do much other than occupy the obstacle and not creep her out.

I have seen a lot written about winging in-set, and I think that a lot of it is wrong (FYI, don't ever come into my set and ask me if I've see Michelle). Good wing vibe involves knowing your wing and being able to predict what sort of things he is going to do in-set (and being able to respond accordingly). IMHO, it takes several times out together to get to the point where a wing is a net plus in-set.

Financial Value
There are some guys in the community who already have a pretty high probability of getting laid when they go out. A few of them will hang out with newbies out of the kindness in their heart, but a lot of the people who have gotten good have started charging for their time. My interpretation is that once you can get laid at will (and I'm not anywhere near there at this point), the community no longer provides you with the same sort of value. The service they offer is a fair one - they have offered to increase the probability you get laid (hence giving you value) in exchange for some amount of money. You may be able to get them to go out with you under some other pretense (and if you're out enough, you WILL bump into these guys and get the opportunity to hang out with them), but it is unlikely that they will be as effective as they would under a student-teacher arrangement. I recommend that everyone pursue professional help at some point.